Comments for Playing Judge at http://www.johnsmulo.com , comment 1 to 34 out of 20 comments http://www.johnsmulo.com Fri, 29 Aug 2008 01:08:27 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.2 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-6633 "Simply put, the word effeminate, in my opinion, describes someone who displays more feminine qualities than masculine qualities and does not imply homosexuality in any way shape or form"... Therefore in context, does this mean that women and girls, who are feminine, are in danger of not inheriting the Kingdom of God because of their natural, God given characteristics? That these characteristics somehow make them less valuable than men? I really don't think so, which is why i would go with the homosexual translation. - sarah Sun, 30 Dec 2007 19:38:18 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-4407 Mike, Thanks for the feedback. I struggle with some of the way verses are interpreted, and the meaning given to words in this context. But still thinking through this. - John Wed, 20 Jun 2007 14:09:06 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-4402 John. Came into this one late but I wanted to let you know that you hit the nail on the head. I think it is natural for us to look at the speck in someone elses eye by looking around the 2X4 in ours. I also do not agree with the translation of "effeminate" to mean homosexual. It refers to behavior, appearance or speech with is similar to that belonging to women or girls or an absence of "vigorous" qualities. I may be going out on a limb. Simply put, the word effeminate, in my opinion, describes someone who displays more feminine qualities than masculine qualities and does not imply homosexuality in any way shape or form. - Mike Wed, 20 Jun 2007 13:06:14 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2426 John, I suppose it depends on the definition of 'sin.' I suspect that many Christians are too hard on themselves and classify all manner of passing thoughts, minor failings and struggles against temptation as 'sin.' Is God so harsh and demanding? I don't think so. After all, he knows we are but flesh and blood. And as I think I've said here previously, the 'end of the charge is a pure heart and a good conscience...' - vynette Mon, 19 Mar 2007 10:29:21 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2417 Fernando, I agree that it is powerful leaving things uncommented. It got me thinking for sure. Thank you for your further explanation and thought. - John Sun, 18 Mar 2007 20:54:05 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2416 I chose not to comment on them, because they seem more powerful when left open-ended. I feel they apply here first of all, because when people today list the "worst" sins they don't tend to mention pride, conceit and arrogance as often as might have been the case in the past. For me the interpretive tradition behind the seven deadly sins speaks powerfully to this question of what sins are more grievous to our relationship with God and pride is right there near the top of the list. Moreover, I do think there *can* be some misplaced pride in pointing out of sin. It's the older borther in the prodigal story again and, of course, it is the problem of shadows. If we have a lot invested in living a righteous life, being an upstanding member of a community, being a devoted servant, then the shadows will always trouble our sense of worth and identity. So the tendency to look down and judge will be there because it assuages our pride and restores our sense of moral order. - fernando Sun, 18 Mar 2007 19:42:36 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2411 Fernando, I saw yesterday that you'd mentioned these verses on your blog without applying them to a particular context. Do you think it applies here in that those who point out one sin above the others are being prideful? - John Sun, 18 Mar 2007 12:35:05 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2410 Vynette, I struggle with your thoughts here. If you're right about Christians not sinning, I'm definitely not a Jesus-follower and I've yet to meet one. - John Sun, 18 Mar 2007 12:33:51 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2409 Paul, I appreciate this about Jesus as well. Instead of concentrating on the outward superficial layers of who we are, he looked deep inside. - John Sun, 18 Mar 2007 12:32:34 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2407 One of today's readings threw an interesting indea into this mix - Proverbs 16.5 "Everyone who is proud in heart is an abomination to the LORD; Assuredly, he will not be unpunished." - fernando Sun, 18 Mar 2007 02:05:45 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2406 John, Both! Scripture attests that a truly 'reborn' Christian, who has symbolically followed Jesus through his crucifixion and resurrection by voluntarily putting the old 'earthy' (Adamic) person to death, has been 'resurrected' as a new spiritual creature, has had all his or her 'sins' washed away and cannot sin in future. "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God." (John 1:12) So it is that genuine spiritually 'reborn' Christians are all children of God, all 'begotten' of God, and all in the same state of 'grace' as pre-Fall Adam and Eve. - vynette Sun, 18 Mar 2007 00:03:45 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2405 I think that was one of the great things about Jesus, he redifined sin from the expression of the action to the substance behind it, whilst we might not commit adultery for instance we may still think the lustful thoughts that lead down that path or we may not kill with out hands but are quite happy to assinate people with our words etc. The kingdom of God is in part an invitation to indwell us where these feelings and attitudes lie and to be part of the transformation inwards and out... It's quite easy to pick on homosexuality they are a minority and most of us are not affected by it - therefore it is very easy to highlight a sin that does not affect me. Indeed it is quite easy to read the bible in a way that highlights others sins instead of asking the bible to read us. In the end the bible leaves us only with an other centred love ethic in treating others and and an encouragement to give each other back our humanity as the Spirit indwells in us and is giving us back our own. - Paul Sun, 18 Mar 2007 00:02:55 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2404 Carmen, Thanks for your follow-up thoughts. I agree that we need to stick with what the Bible allows. God help us if we think we know better than Scripture. That said, at times--for example with the women's issue that I raised this week, or slavery or racism at earlier times--I think we mistake the common opinion in the Christian community for what the Bible says. I personally doubt many people in the Christian community have done little more than looked at this issue more than superficially. If they did otherwise, I don't know that this would change their overall perspective, though at the least I think it would leave us with more grace. You raised that some are fearful, or are concerned with how associating with certain people would effect their faith. I think this is quite a widespread problem, and if Christians interacted more with a wide diversity of people, we'd have a much easier time showing grace because we'd see people as people instead of labels associated with our fears. Yes, I do know there are people out there who love people no matter what. I thank God for these people! I hear you on the need to temper things somewhat--and I think you do that very well. Though I also fear that tempering things will be the first step toward accepting a new status quo. This may be unreasonable, I'm not sure. But I think that the most important thing is that we don't major on criticizing what has been, but focus on moving a head. Last, but not least. I have far more questions than answers when it comes to this particular topic. - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 23:29:58 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2403 John, First of all, keep in mind that these are pretty much off the cuff remarks, so I certainly could be messed up on a number of matters . . . even the paper clip thing! :) Second, I have questions too. :) I agree that the hermaphrodites thing messes up our neat categorization, which was my point. However, I first of all think that this is fairly rare (though I admit it is a "can of worms" issue) Next, I still think we have to believe something when it comes to these matters. At the end of the day, we must figure out and apply Scripture in some way, and--though our desires and preferences matter, Scripture (to the degree that we rightly understand it) must take precedence. To use a hyperbole, a man might say he loves to steal/have sex with many women/pick fights/drive airplanes into buildings/etc. but we wouldn't say that these were proper simply because some people are inclined to them. I exagerate for effect, but my point is that we must deal with both our personal likes/dislikes and what the bible allows for. Sometimes, our personal preferences can cause us to reconsider our interpretations, which is a good thing. But our preferences should not (ideally) be allowed to take such a priority that we actualy twist the bible's meaning. As for the standard approach you mentioned, I mostly agree. There has been way too much of this arrogance and hatred. Then again, I have noticed a tendency among some to exaggerate these matters. I know of quite a few traditional types who would never think of harming a homosexual. For instance in my first church, which was more rigid than I prefer, there was a mix. Some of them were mean-spirited, and this did bother me. Others were kind. And still others were not so much mean as afraid, fearful that contact with the unknown might harm them or fearful that their faith might be challenged. Again, I agree that the church in general has reacted this negative way, and we should be ashamed. But there are still good people out there who love people no matter what. I know you know this, John. [As an aside of sorts, a lot of postmodern ministry and discussion seems to center on the errors of modernity. This is due, in part, to the experiences of those who fled from those churches (often after spiritual abuse). BELIEVE ME, I understand this completely, for I have had my own painful times. Still--and I am NOT putting myself up as a standard on this--I also think that the initial reactionary spirit (which, in God's grace, can be a good thing) must eventually back off a little and lead to a more seasoned approach. Thus, if my 9 year old throws something at my 13 year old, the impulse of my 13 year old is to react quickly and strongly. When this occurs, I completely understand, and I correct my 9 year old. But I also do not encourage my 13 year old to over-react. That is a sign of immaturity. I guess my point is that in the process of reactiing against stuff (and there is and will always be a lot to react against), at some point we have to temper this a bit. Actually, John, you seem to do a great job of this, and for that I am thankful. I, on the other hand, am only beginning to work my way in this direction. - Carmen DiCello Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:52:29 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2402 Marjorie, Thanks for your helpful comment! I definitely think you're on to something important in regard to some people not being able to understand God's grace and love because of how modern Pharisees have portrayed him. - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:24:16 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2401 Mike, I agree. The hypocrisy of it all sucks. - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:21:38 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2400 Carmen, With you part 2, yep and yep and yep, etc. For me, these are somewhat more straightforward questions, though still complex. - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:20:51 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2399 Carmen, In relation to your part 1, the more I think about these things, the more questions I have--and am starting to read more and think further through. But take your example of hermaphrodites. That kind of screws up our neat categories of sexuality. What do we do with people who from a young age have struggled with same-sex attraction, which comes for them as naturally as heterosexuality does for you and I? I mean, the standard approach has been to ridicule them, isolate them, and tell them they're on the highway to hell. But even if Jesus disagrees with same-sex relationships--noting that some disagree that he would disagree--would Jesus treat people in this way? Adultery was a stoneable offense in the OT, yet Jesus treats the women caught in adultery with more grace than most bosses would treat an employee who stole a paper-clip (yeah, back to my paper-clip!). What does this say to us? - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:11:48 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2398 I feel that sin separates me from God regardless of what kind of sin it is, but I am clean and holy when I accept Jesus. I think about Peter’s dream with the food God tells him to eat even though it is considered unclean for some of his fellow Jews. Could this be a parallel for us not to judge others? Could it be that some people have been hurt by the judgment of today’s Pharisees and therefore do not understand God’s love, mercy and grace? I agree with Charles in his comment, “We are helpless in our sins.” I am a sinner because it is impossible to live a sinless life. This is why Jesus had to die for my sins. However, while I turn my sins and weaknesses over to the Lord, I believe I can have victory. I am learning to be honest with myself and my relationship with the Lord, and have come to the conclusion that I have to continually receive help from the Lord if I am going to grow spiritually. - Marjorie Van Noy Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:44:26 +0100 http://www.johnsmulo.com/playing-judge-7.html#comment-2397 Vynette, Are you saying that if we follow Jesus we don't sin anymore in this life, or that we're forgiven of all of our sins? - John Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:42:28 +0100